One of my wife's sisters called the other evening to talk to my wife, who was not home. We started talking - about birthdays first, as both my SIL and I have just turned 50. I said that turning 50 had been a time of reflection for me, in which the realization of the passing of time and missed opportunities for experience was particularly acute. She pressed the issue and instead of giving the stock "I'm fine, we're fine" response, I told her that while my wife and I had mastered the art of "peaceful coexistence", I was very unhappy with the absence of sexual interactions with my wife.
She asked me what I was going to do about it. My SIL shared with me that fact that she had made up her mind to leave her husband and live her own life as soon as her kids were grown up. And she did - when her youngest was a freshman in college, she had a brief affair, moved out, entered the workforce, and became an independent person for the first time in her life. It has not been easy for her, but she is much happier now.
I told her that I could not see divorcing my wife while my son is still young. Yes, I have given that a lot of thought over the past few weeks. Every indication is that my son NEEDS a stable two-parent household for his growth and development. Hence my emphasis on peaceful co-existence.
It was nice to be able to share aspects of my wife's behavior with another person who knows her quite well. My SIL and my wife lived together for a couple of years before I met my wife. The low libido status of my wife was not a surprise to my SIL. It is not that my wife had difficulty with orgasms during sex. Quite the contrary. Yet her overall enthusiasm for sexual activity, in both frequency and variety, has always been low. Both my SIL and I are puzzled over the persistence of my wife's low libido. My SIL assures me that this is NOT a family trait.
She also commented that my wife's tendency to leave piles of stuff laying around drove her crazy when they lived together. Clutter anyone?
We also talked about how my wife and I deal with the absence of sexual interactions. Not only do we not have sex, but we don't talk about it. Very much a "don't ask, don't tell" situation. I don't ask and she doesn't tell. We have been to therapy together, briefly, several years ago. That didn't last because my wife was "too busy" to schedule joint counseling sessions. And in the past two years, my few attempts at bringing the subject up have gone nowhere. Since the knee-jerk response is "communication", let me relate our few attempts at communication on this topic over the past year.
A brief background: My wife has had some inflammation of her internal organs over the past few years. Finally, after going round and round with a number of specialists and different tests, she began a pharmacological regime about three months ago that seems to be addressing the problem.
Back to "communication". Not only do we not have sex, but we don't talk about it. Two weeks before my birthday, I asked her if she was interested in resuming sexual interactions. She was visibly embarrassed, but said yes, but only if it is not painful. I expressed my own concern to not cause her pain and let the conversation drop. About 10 days later, she was talking about buying stuff for my birthday and I said, jokingly, you don't have to BUY me anything as I reached out to her with my arms to give her a hug. She knew what I was talking about, as she visibly stiffened and gave me a "here you go again" look. End of conversation. Sum total of conversations on the topic of sex over the past two years: Two.
I would appreciate advice on where to go from here. I could push counseling or conversations or even, as the inflammation issue continues to improve, for resuming sexual interactions. Or simply continue with the theme of peaceful coexistence.
Sunday, April 20, 2008
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10 comments:
Thank you for sharing this about your SIL, it is really nice to hear I am not the only "nuts" woman in the universe.
The sad thing is, your story is so similar to other's I have heard,differences in libido, a history of painful intercourse, a child that needs more than the 'ordinary' amount of attention, and years of not communicating openly (on both sides) leads to this place you are both now in. There is no standard answer. Counseling works for some, if both parties are willing to "put it all out there", and use the presence of the therapist as a mediator to insure both parties truly understand what is being said, and felt.
Painful intercourse does not have to mean no intimacy, there is so much more to sexual intimacy than intercourse...so very much more...and that may be a course of action to explore.
One couple I know took intercourse completely out of the equation for quite some time. They used bathing together, mutual massage, kissing, and slow gentle explorations to recreate intimacy.
Both partners have to be willing though...and getting to that point can be quite difficult when one partner has no desire to communicate.
I suppose you could ask her what she misses in the way of intimacy. I remember telling my husband, I missed what he considered the small insignificant things...but I missed them when he stopped them. I missed him coming up behind me while I stood at the kitchen sink and sliding his hands up my blouse. I missed lying next to him on the sofa, and feeling his hands stroking through my hair, I missed him walking into the bathroom while I was bathing, just to see me wet and naked, to give himself a visual thrill. Little symbols, that show the other is still attracted.
A person's own inhibitions also play such a large role. Tis sad our society only feeds them, instead of promoting how truly healthy and pleasurable true sexual intimacy is.
I have no advice. My husband and I have an okay sex life but rarely talk about it. He is not comfortable talking about sex so I gave up. I have to feel very safe to talk openly about sex and our relationship has too many other problems to bother dealing with sex right now. It's kind of the at the bottom of the pile. The sex we have is pretty good but I know it could be better and would like that but pretty good is alright right now.
I'm sorry, this was supposed to be about you. Try the counselling, who knows. It might help.
I'm getting better at telling my husband what I need from him and I'm finding myself telling him that he needs to be very specific when he talks to me. I can't read his mind. but I'm too anxious to discuss sex like that. Too loaded a topic, no pun intended.
do you read this woman at all?
http://ex-courtesan.blogspot.com/
I'm all on board w/what SD said about making specific inquiries about what types of intimacy she might enjoy (w/the pressure of having intercourse completely off the table)...
I joked w/P yesterday that I was going to create a set of flashcards for him, "for romantic moments" -- it has helped us tremendously for me to just OPEN MY MOUTH & TELL him what I want/need from him.
Sunny - the world is full of nuts - you're in good company! Seriously, I admire what you are doing, as it is too easy to just go along and not upset anybody else's applecart. But who is looking after your apples?
I am fully aware that my situation is not unique. Some (not you) might say "look, just grin and bear it like everyone else". But I say - "hey, wait a minute - this is MY life and it is the ONLY one that I get!" (to paraphrase Mary Oliver). The two therapists that I have seen over the past few years have, it seemed to me, generally relied on stock approaches and were not been very good at understanding that my situation is unique to me. Maybe it will be better this time around.
I completely agree that there is more to physical intimacy than intercourse. I will continue to pursue that direction with my wife. (VAL - good suggestion about explicitly taking intercourse - or any sexual activity - off the table). Yes, you are right that we have both contributed to the history of not communicating on this topic. So I need to be more persistent and creative and subtle in pursuing this. Just that at times there seems to be such a total lack of interest on her part that I start to think "why bother".
Deb and Val - Telling others what I want is most definitely not my strong suit. With effort in this direction, I am getting better. It is hard to get over the anxiety, though practice seems to be the only way. Money and sex are both high anxiety topics for my wife and I.
Thanks for the suggestion - I'll look at her blog.
I wish I could have a long conversation with you over a pitcher of beer (or the poison of your choice). As a start, I do think you need to let your wife know what you want/need/long for in terms of sex and in terms of intimacy -- if only so that you can say that you gave her a chance. It may be uncomfortable talking to her, but you really must give it a try. Perhaps in writing? Bottom line, though -- there isn't much you can do about a low libido.
Of course, I have no words of wisdom here for you. I do agree with the lines of communication regarding your wants and needs. It isn't easy, this I know. I've done it so many times only to have it fall on deaf ears. At least it is the chance you can take to be heard.
Anais and c-marie - A pitcher of beer would be good - like most college towns, we have a local brew-pub that is perfectly suitable for beer and conversation on the patio. Or we could go to the winery overlooking the River. You are right - this conversation needs to be resumed. Without speaking up, I only guarantee that I will NOT be heard.
Well, I don't know if discussing your private life with your SIL was a good decision. These kinds of conversations have a way of backfiring if you aren't careful. (And when you least expect it.)
I think marital therapy sessions is a good place to start. Maybe you could wait until you and your wife are having a really good day, getting along well, etc. And then tell her that your lack of sex is becoming unbearable and that unless you seek counseling, you may be forced to think about ending the relationship. This way, at least she will know how serious this issue is to you and also realize that you are willing to seek help before you bolt.
And it is important that as you say this, you keep your voice calm and non-threatening. She needs to know that this is a team problem and she is part of that team.
Maria - your warning about discussing this with my SIL is well-taken. Yes, it may come back to my in ways that might surprise me. I think the reason I did is that I get so tired of the pat "I'm fine" response when asked about how I am.
Thank you for the suggestion on how to bring up the topic of counseling again.
I have a friend who in her first marriage had sexual problems with her hubby. 3 years and no sex. She is remarried and has been for a few years but she told me that her current husband isn't interested now. I am wondering could it be her?
Personally I am all about going after what I want. I told her if her husband isn't interested then she needs to GET HIM INTERESTED. She got so embarrassed and said she couldn't do it.
Is your wife normally shy sexually?? Maybe she has issues like my friend. ?
Personally, my hubby is way more interested than I am and could and would do it everyday if I would say yes, but we have a fairly okay sex life, usually 2 or more times a week.
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